A three team trade proposal for Milwaukee, Miami, and Memphis
by smitty7789
on Jun 30, 2008 12:08 PM CDT
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The Bucks need a power forward that plays defense, gets the rebounds, and basically, one that plays Scott Skiles' ball. The other need the Bucks have is to get a more pure point guard. Looking at the Bucks from this angle, I looked at some other young and rebuilding teams around the league that might be willing to make a deal. I thought of some needs teams might have that also have a few good chips for the Bucks. Let's start with the players involved in my three team deal that works under the ESPN trade machine
Memphis Grizzlies get:
SF- Desmond Mason
PF- Charlie Villanueva
PF/C- Mark Blount
Miami Heat get:
PG/SG- Marko Jaric
PG- Mo Williams
Milwaukee Bucks get:
PF- Udonis Haslem
PG- Mike Conley
SG- Greg Buckner
My Analyzation and why I think it's a great trade for all teams:
Mainly, it provides all teams with position needs. Miami needs a point guard, Memphis needs big guys, and the Bucks need a pass-first defensive point guard like Conley and a bruising 4 like Haslem.
Memphis does gain a lot for giving up only Conley and Greg Buckner. Desmond Mason really is not a bad pick-up. Memphis really only gives up Mike Conley, whom they reportedly have been shopping since they already have a pleathera of nice young and cheaper point guards such as Kyle Lowry who really came on last season. Memphis and Miami basically swap bad contracts, although it is noted Blount's contract does expire one year before Jaric's, thus sweeting the deal for Memphis if only a little. Greg Buckner should never be considered not expendable but with the trade for O.J. Mayo, it seems the SG position is shored up.
Miami finally gets Mo Williams after reportedly coveting him for years. Losing Haslem does not hurt them as much as they just drafted Michael Beasley. Gaining Mo would allow them to package Jason Williams, Marcus Banks, or Marko Jaric's amazing contract for a quality defensive center giving them a nice balance with Beasley at the 4 (I still don't believe Beasley, at 6'7, will ever be a dominant power forward, but that's another discussion). Miami also cuts 2 million in cap space with the Blount for Jaric swap.
Milwaukee gains a great young point guard who passes first and plays defense, something they lacked with Mo Williams. This allows Michael Redd, Richard Jefferson, and Bogut to get more shots and have a point guard to run the offense. Pairing Conley up with another 7 foot great young center again would be a fun sight. Udonis Haslem shores up any concerns regarding the 4 spot and provides defense, rebounding, and a tough mentality. All three of these were sorely lacking with Charlie V. This allows Alexander to come off the bench for Haslem or Jefferson and allows the Bucks to sub in Alexander once a team brings in one of their smaller power forwards. The loss of Desmond Mason would hurt the Bucks a little but we do cut cap space in this trade; not only this but with this trade I think we finally would see the transformation of the Bucks from a soft finnesse team to a tougher, defensive minded with offensive balance team, one that fits Scott Skiles' playing style much better.
As for the reality of this deal happening, i honestly do not believe the trade is lopsided for any teams involved. I believe it works for all teams involved. Not only this, but it works with all of the players' salaries factored in. I am interested to hear from Heat, Grizzlies, and Bucks fans and see if they would agree to a trade like this if they were the team's manager. Please get on your phone now J Ham.
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oh snap
Getting Haslem AND Mike Conley? Sign me up for the bandwagon for this trade. Haslem would be a great upgrade at the 4, as he can put in the effort on the defensive end while Redd, Bogut, and RJ can get their points on the other end. Losing D-Mase makes room for Alexander and Luc to play at the 3, losing Charlie V makes Skiles’ life a lot easier, and losing Mo Williams will make Redd (at least as a player) very, very happy.
From a Milwaukee standpoint, the only downside I can find is that Conley’s presence would disrupt Ramon Sessions’ development as a PG. But he could use a season or two playing on the second squad, just for seasoning. Then we can go from there.
Smitty, I don’t know who you are, but you’re pretty much my favorite person ever. I’d pull the trigger on this trade in a Len Bias post draft heartbeat.
-- "I do know that I plead the fizzif."
by Mitchell_M on
Jun 30, 2008 5:57 PM CDT
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Also,
J Ham is a sweet nickname.
-- "I do know that I plead the fizzif."
by Mitchell_M on
Jun 30, 2008 5:59 PM CDT
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Great for the Bucks and fine for the Heat, but I think the Grizz get seriously ripped off. Swapping Buckner for Blount costs them money and Desmond’s expiring deal isn’t worth all that much considering they’re adding salary with the other pieces. CV has some value but I don’t think it’s nearly enough to pry Conley away.
The Grizz are going with the youth movement and Conley’s the youngest/best PG prospect they have. I’m sure they’d much rather deal Lowry, especially given the optics of trading a fourth overall pick won’t help their PR problems. Of course if you just swap in Lowry for Conley I don’t think the Bucks get quite enough value back, though they would be helping themselves salary-wise. Adding in Hakim Warrick makes it a little better I suppose.
Problem is that I think in a general sense swapping Mo/CV for Haslem/Lowry is a talent downgrade; it probably fits better and is cheaper in the long term, but I’m not sure if the Bucks are willing to gain fit at the expense of talent. That’s a big question that will be interesting to watch for IMO.
by Frank Madden on
Jun 30, 2008 6:11 PM CDT
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You really know how to rain on my parade Frank, haha just kidding. I don’t know if I agree the Grizz are getting that ripped off. They just got rid off Mike Miller, thus leaving a huge hole for them at the number 3 spot. Desmond Mason although may not be in the prime of his career but he’s still an upgrade over Greg Buckner. You also have to remember they are getting rid of Marko Jaric’s 6 million 4 year deal. Blount’s is 7 million for 3 years, so it’s not that huge of a difference. They really only gain 2 million in salary with the swap of Buckner for Mason and Jaric for Blount.
I don’t know how I feel yet if it was Haslem/Lowry. I was thinking the same thing regarding the talent downgrade. However, I think the Bucks already did a lot of “talent first” moves in the past few days. A trade like this would “balance” those moves and just make the team feel more settled to me. Even if they found some way to make the salaries work with Haslem and Lowry, I still think a lineup of Lowry & Sessions splitting time at the point, Redd, Jefferson, Haslem, and Bogut would produce more wins than Mo Williams and Charlie V filling in their respective spots on this team. An example would be last years Boston Celtics. Suppose the Celtics traded the Bucks Rajon Rondo and Kendrick Perkins at the beginning of the year. Talent-wise I think most would agree Mo and Charlie V would be a significant talent upgrade over Rondo and Perkins (especially at the beginning of last year), but I have a very hard time believing the Celtics win the championship with Mo williams and his 2.7 turnovers per game and forced shots at the helm. Same if they don’t have a solid role player such as Perkins anchoring their defense.
Kyle Lowry isn’t that bad of a player either, much cheaper while averaging 1.5 turnovers per game. He played decent defense on a bad defensive club last year. I don’t think I would mind the trade even with Lowry instead of Conley. I just feel like the Bucks have gone the route of, “let’s get the 5 most talented guys together with no direction to this team.” Mo Williams and Charlie V just don’t fit the direction this team is and should be going, therefore their value to the Bucks shouldn’t be based on their NBA value. And let’s be honest, these guys are going to be worth half of what they are worth currently a year from now if they stay with the Bucks; especially Mo Williams.
Shout out to Vin Baker, Shawn Respert, Tractor Traylor, and Anthony Mason; you ruined my childhood.
by smitty7789 on
Jun 30, 2008 7:01 PM CDT
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the only problem with your Celtics comparison is
Pierce-Allen-Garnett > RJ-Redd-Bogut
individually, Redd might have the edge over Ray-Ray, but Pierce and Garnett were integral to that team’s success. I sincerely believe that the attitude that KG brought (and subsequently rediscovered by The Truth) was the number one reason that team met such success.
-- "I do know that I plead the fizzif."
by Mitchell_M on
Jun 30, 2008 7:24 PM CDT
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I actually forgot about Jaric entirely, my mistake.
I guess my perspective on Memphis is that they’re not really trying to win now so a vet like Mason is mostly just taking up space, and they already have two cornerstone pieces at the 2/3 with Mayo and Rudy Gay. Des would just be a backup, so I don’t see him really swaying a deal much..
I do agree about your fit argument-I think the current team with Lowry/Haslem instead of Mo/CV probably does win more games. Both guys can defend and are role-playing starters, which makes sense on a team with RJ/Redd/Bogut. But I think Hammond is going to be very careful about how he uses his remaining assets, so he might hold off for a while before he makes a trade aimed at producing a better fit. To be honest I wouldn’t at all be surprised if Skiles uses Mo off the bench if he’s still around-he wasn’t afraid to do that with Gordon and given all of our scoring will be among the starters, moving Mo to the second unit would make a lot of sense.
Btw, love that signature, Smitty…
by Frank Madden on
Jun 30, 2008 7:31 PM CDT
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