Maggette gives his experience an "F" - should we resign ourselves to that?
The timing seems strange. Corey Maggette just had his best game in what seems like a year and half, but after Milwaukee's 90-77 loss in Chicago, Maggette didn't sugar-coat things. He spoke to the Milwaukee Journal-Sentinal:
"If I had to grade it, I'd grade it an F," Maggette said of his time with the Bucks. "I'm just going to be honest. We've still got a lot of time. We've still got to stay positive."
Harsh words, ones that can be read from a whole mess of angles. There's no denying Maggette's role in Milwaukee has been largely a mystery to this point, marked by a string of performances as inconsistent as the rest of the team. He was supposed to be a potential 6th Man of the Year candidate, a guy who would be asked to do little more than get to the rim and get to the line. He was never expected to buy into the defensive system entirely. As the quintessential "instant-offense" bench player, it wouldn't be an issue if he occasionally got burned on a slow rotation or lost his man on a backdoor cut.
Sadly, things have not worked out as planned. Before you respond to this poll, read on.
Part of the prediction has come true. Maggette hasn't totally bought into any sort of defensive system. Heck, he hasn't even seen the court with any regularity. Regardless of the effect a string of injuries may have had, it's been pretty difficult to argue against him being in the metaphorical doghouse, and the Bulls game might have simply represented the rock-bottom of circumstances: the Bucks are so riddled with injuries that few options remain. True offensive threats are at an absolute premium in Milwaukee these days, especially when Andrew Bogut misses almost everything he throws up. The fact that Maggette has been relegated to a last-resort speaks to how much of a wreck the team has been to this point.
The stats say he hasn't been awful, but defensive statistics hardly tell a complete story, and there's no denying that swapping Maggette out for almost any comparable player on Milwaukee's roster is probably a defensive improvement. But whatever level of performance he's managing on that end evidently isn't satisfactory to the people in charge, and it's enough to keep out of games. What other explanation can there be, when the offense has been nothing if not ineffective to this point?
True two-way superstars are incredibly rare. Guys like Michael Jordan or Tim Duncan, who augment brilliant offensive games with spectacular abilities to frustrate their opponents on the other end. Corey Maggette will never qualify for such a title; it's laughable to even bring the point up. But the Bucks' defense was best in the league early in the year when he was logging more minutes. If Scott Skiles is a standout defensive coach, one defensively-challenged bench player shouldn't be an insurmountable obstacle. Doc Rivers runs Ray Allen out in the starting lineup every night, for cryin' out loud!
Yet here in Milwaukee, the perception is that you have to earn your playing time by showing a dedication to defense and playing hard. In words: as the defense goes, so goes the offense. I'm here to offer a counter arguement: the Bucks are 12-18. They have the worst offense in the league and are dangerously close to a historically poor shooting year. The percentage of shots they take from 16-23 feet is ninth-highest in the NBA, even though they are the fourth-worst shooting team from that range. Only the New Jersey Nets shoot worse at the rim. If there's a crisis in Milwaukee, it's not an underperforming defense. It's an offense that needs a jump start--not from a car battery, but from a nuclear generator.
Is Corey Maggette the answer to these problems? Not on his own. But remember how excited we all were about the prospect of running a guy out on the floor who would just go go go score score score? There were reasons for that excitement. Maggette remains, when he's playing well, a uniquely dangerous player. So why has he fallen apart in Milwaukee?
I spy a couple explanations. Although his shooting numbers on long two's are mostly in line with his career numbers, he's taking eight shots per 40 minutes from that distance, a huge jump from the last few years. He's also shooting his fewest shots at the rim in 4 years. We've heard a lot about floor spacing in Milwaukee, and how a general lack thereof is causing trouble, allowing defenses to collapse on anybody who gets close to the basket. Why doesn't Maggette get the same concession? In Golden State, Maggette was often playing with Monta Ellis and Stephen Jackson, constant shooting threats who could prevent defenses from converging on the rim every time Corey barreled towards it. Ever since Carlos Delfino went down, opponents have made clear their intention to let Milwaukee's shooters shoot, and it certainly hasn't burned them.
In response, I propose a radical idea: start Maggette. Run out a lineup of Dooling (for the time being), Salmons, Maggette, Ilyasova, and Bogut. While Dooling may lack Brandon Jennings' playmaking ability (I use "may" literally there, as many have begun to question Jennings' playmaking ability), he's still a capable point. With Dooling, Salmons, and Ilyasova offering at least a threat of perimeter shooting, this is probably the best floor-spacing lineup the Bucks have right now. If Maggette goes selfish, barreling toward the rim every time he gets the ball, then bench him. But this idea that our defense is worth preserving at the expensive of one of our most talented offensive players is quickly wearing out.
It may be too early to worry about things like this, considering the Bucks are still totally alive in the Eastern Conference Playoff race. A lot of people feel that Maggette just isn't a Milwaukee guy, and that his success will always be held back by a level of discontent. But if we grant that things aren't going well right now, then don't we have to consider how we'd feel if they were?
Maggette gives his experience an "F." As a fan with high expectations, would you grade things much better?
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Might as well start him.
Honestly, as much as he annoys with his lack of awareness, I feel a lot more comfortable with our offense when he’s on the floor.
"Center Andrew Bogut was asked how the Bucks are fitting in their many new players so far. Chris Douglas-Roberts -- one of those new guys, not happy with his role -- chuckled in the next stall."
I'm curious what the question was
The linked story never states what Maggette was asked, just that he gave it an F. Was the question about his overall experience with the team (on- and off-court) or about how he’s played while on the court? If the question was more about how he’s played while he’s on the flooor and he’s giving himself an F, that’s one thing. If it’s how he sees himself fitting with the team and says it’s an F, that’s another. Maybe I’m not making the distinction clear.
Either way, his reputation makes it hard to give him the benefit of the doubt. I’m just not sure what he was really answering.
I never use a big word when a diminutive word would suffice.
The person who asked it (Steve Haywood)
Later said it was about the experience of the team as a whole and record-wise,including himself, not that he hated being here.
"Center Andrew Bogut was asked how the Bucks are fitting in their many new players so far. Chris Douglas-Roberts -- one of those new guys, not happy with his role -- chuckled in the next stall."
by Jacob Grinyer on Dec 30, 2010 12:35 PM CST up reply actions
if the question
was how have things gone for the team and him so far, an F is a reasonable grade.
so far, it’s a terrible season.
Maggette used some boilerplate team language, but if he was really thinking/feeling about his stay here to date, then probably it works to create some separation. he might be angling for a trade.
i don’t see it as a “team cancer” statement. don’t think it reduces his trade value. BUT i question how much trade value he has to begin with. nobody wanted him and his contract earlier. he hasn’t had a decent season so far. somebody might take him and give us nothing, and many would say good riddance. I wouldn’t be one of them.
i still favor tough-love/tough-talk/reasonable-accommodation between the coaches and Mr. M. I’d rather rehabilitate him than reject him.
Ah, thanks
I think the article makes it sound like Maggette is selfishly complaining about his role and the team, but I don’t think that’s quite fair. If Andrew Bogut graded the team’s season so far an F, I don’t think many would disagree.
I never use a big word when a diminutive word would suffice.
Not a cancerous statement by Magette
A blunt honest one. We’re supposed to value that in this town, correct? I am sure the entire team would grade it an F.
I agree with starting him
Skiles HAS to realize that, although he preaches defense and team play, he needs a player (and Maggette fits that role) to exhibit a little bit of selfishness on offense.
I agree with Frank – put in a lineup that will help stretch the D a little and open things up for the only slasher we have on the team: Corey Magette. They got him for a reason, and it’s time that we utilize his skills to drag this team out of their offensive doldrums.
A system is ONLY a system Mr. Skiles. Even you have to start tweaking a little.
i agree too
Stubbornness is useful in a coach, with 15 players tugging and pulling at him in multiple directions. Keeps things from slip, slip, slipping away. But stubbornness can also result in going into battle with a major mismatch between the strategy and the troops. Adjust Mr. Skiles, adjust!
Skiles has to look at the context
And that is, a few of their offensive weapons are out right now: Gooden, Jennings and Delfino. This is the perfect time to pump up minutes for Maggette.
A system is there to serve the team, not the other way around. As injuries deplete us, the time for tweaks goes up.
Only three Bucks haven't started: Skinner, Boykins and Maggette
One of those three is not like the other.
by Frank Madden on Dec 30, 2010 5:51 PM CST up reply actions
Skiles
I agree to start him. Skiles has to realize that two very valuable things about Maggette for the Bucks
Defensively, he puts other teams best offensive players in foul trouble and competely remove them from the action as much as possible. In the first quarter, I’d let him barrel into guys and get O fouls in an attempt to gain the advantage.
Offensively, if he does get the fouls, it puts the Bucks in the penalty early in quarters. I would start him for the beginning of each quarter at least.
Last, I think too much as been read into this comment “F” grading. I also remember him saying when healthy its going to be very hard for teams to beat them, so the F grading leans more on the fact that they have been unable to get healthy and just flat out haven’t lived up to expectations to win.
Agreed
Don’t think Maggette should be demonized for being honest, and for all the talk/worry about him being selfish with the ball and just barreling at the hoop and forcing shots I would argue that Salmons currently does this anyway with limited results. With Cory on the floor with Salmons I do worry a little about ball movement but all I’ve seen in the last 5 games or so is the high pick and role leading to mid-range jumpers anyway. We gotta try something new, not much to lose
I think I brained my damage! - Homer Simpson
Nowitzki didn't play against the Raps
Any word on Saturday?
Chris Bosh said he's happy because he can get League Pass now in Miami. In Toronto, said he didn't have "the good cable."
He's out again tonight
But it’s just day-to-day, so tough to say if he’ll still be out on Saturday.
www.Brewhoop.com, http://where55happens.wordpress.com
by Dan Sinclair on Dec 30, 2010 7:05 PM CST up reply actions
I think
They should rest him lol
Chris Bosh said he's happy because he can get League Pass now in Miami. In Toronto, said he didn't have "the good cable."
I'll be there, behind the Bucks bench, ready to watch the bricks fly up close and personal
And quite frankly, I won’t be too disappointed if he doesn’t play ;)
"Center Andrew Bogut was asked how the Bucks are fitting in their many new players so far. Chris Douglas-Roberts -- one of those new guys, not happy with his role -- chuckled in the next stall."
by Jacob Grinyer on Dec 30, 2010 7:27 PM CST up reply actions
The schedule for the next 2 weeks is just cruel..... very cruel.
It’s likely the Bucks will be atleast 10 games under .500 when it’s over on Jan 13…..
So then what???
Ugh…
We die?
"Center Andrew Bogut was asked how the Bucks are fitting in their many new players so far. Chris Douglas-Roberts -- one of those new guys, not happy with his role -- chuckled in the next stall."
by Jacob Grinyer on Dec 30, 2010 8:56 PM CST up reply actions
Pretty much.... But it'll make for fabulous chatter come the draft lottery drawing
Oh well…. it could be worse. We could be the Blazers….
Looks like Brandon Roy’s career is about done.
Nah.... I'm just playing devil's advocate.... I still have the Bucks in the POs....
But as the 7th or 8th seed w/ a .500ish record.
“What could have been” is becoming water under the bridge. Injuries have screwed this team this yr.
I’m hoping for a good 2nd half of the season – a win or two in the POs – and then on to next season.
If healthy and clicking, I think they could put a scare into any team…. but I’m realistic that they prob won’t advance past the 1st rd – provided they don’t totally tank and miss the playoffs.
I'm ususally a pessimist but....
What could have been still could be. I don’t care that we won’t win 50 games, it means jack anyway, what needs to happen is that this team peaks at the right time and is smoking and healthy going into the playoffs. I’ll be like the Captain maybe and go down with the ship but I still think we can be a better than good team.
Chris Bosh said he's happy because he can get League Pass now in Miami. In Toronto, said he didn't have "the good cable."
by CanadaBucks on Dec 31, 2010 12:37 PM CST up reply actions
Nice story
I like the idea!
Frankly, after seeing the offense thus far, I’m open to any idea.
I think we’ve been thinking that our FG% had to improve at some stage, but things still aren’t working. It seems obvious that a change in strategy and added some variety to our play is required.
I don't demand a winning team, but...
…I can’t expend 2.5-hour chunks of my life watching a team that is dead in the water. Where they are doing the same ol’ things, and the same ol’ things are continuing to fail. Maybe Skiles demands that because that’s his vision of his team’s best chance. Do it until you get it right. Until you prove you’re man enough to make your shots.
But it puts the players in a small box where they are likely to not meet their coach’s expectations. A box that becomes a straight-jacket. Guaranteed to fail.
If the current pattern is failure – the worst offense in the league – why isn’t change of any reasonable kind a possible antidote? Break the repetitive cycle. Give their self-confidence a chance to reset and rebuild.
Coach Skiles surely can help his men play defense. He’s a very good coach. But (to risk getting touchy-feely) I don’t know if he can help them be men. From what I see & hear, he challenges them to prove their manhood by making their shots. In a context that suggests that if they don’t, then they have failed him. Disappointed him. Not his fault.
My view is that if the team fails, Skiles fails. He can’t just challenge; he has to coach them in the way…
Love this response
I think you’re right about Skiles. He’s really set in his ways, because they obviously worked really well last season when the team was playing well. But now, when things aren’t working, he seems unwilling to change or adapt in an effort to get the team going. If he keeps up the act and guys start making shots, great, because then he’s got a system in place that he and most of the players are comfortable with. But what we’re all obviously concerned about is what happens if it never comes around. We’ll just get more of the same, which isn’t good enough right now.
I agree that Skiles is avoiding blame in doing so, which isn’t fair. I haven’t reached the point where I’m calling for his head, but he’s been at least as disappointing as some of the players so far this year. I’m worried that the “Skiles burnout” has already been set in motion. Unless something changes dramatically, this could even uglier, FAST.
Fun way to welcome the New Year, huh?
www.Brewhoop.com, http://where55happens.wordpress.com
by Dan Sinclair on Dec 31, 2010 12:37 PM CST up reply actions
I'm worried about the same thing
Skiles sticks to his system so religiously that it gets to the point where It makes it harder to win games. Maggette might not be the best defensive player (Probably an understatement) but this team’s problem is on the offensive end, not defensively.
If this continues, and we’re getting into an insanely tough stretch with three straight games of Miami and Orlando, the players are going to start to questioning him, if they aren’t already. And by that point, will their morale be high enough to keep fighting when the schedule gets easier?
Last year’s team had the benefit of a lot of quiet, low key hard working guys that stuck to Skiles plan and played within his system. Now? We have tons of new guys that are not used to this.
"Center Andrew Bogut was asked how the Bucks are fitting in their many new players so far. Chris Douglas-Roberts -- one of those new guys, not happy with his role -- chuckled in the next stall."
by Jacob Grinyer on Dec 31, 2010 12:49 PM CST up reply actions
when skiles got hired
all we heard about is how eventually the players would tune him out. has it happened here yet??
"I would say my biggest flaw, my Achilles heel is my tireless work ethic"-Kenny Powers
tune out?
I started Skiles “reign” thinking he had matured some. Learned on the job, and wouldn’t make the same mistakes. Now I don’t know. As a fan, it’s easy to overreact and call for Change when what’s really required is patience. There’s quite a bit to be said for continuity in getting through bad periods – rather than hit-or-miss changes. But when the funk is prolonged, I would think a manager of men would try something new to relieve the pressure.
And maybe Skiles is...
We don’t get much news about what’s going on with the team. Maybe he’s directly facing the issue.

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