Bucks vs. Bobcats Preview: Stephen Jackson Back In Charlotte For Bucks Debut
by Frank Madden on Dec 26, 2011 3:06 AM CST
in Previews
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Print| 2010/2011 NBA Season | ||
|---|---|---|
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vs. |  |
| 0-0 (0-0 road) | 0-0 (0-0 home) |
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| December 26, 2011 | ||
| Time Warner Cable Arena | ||
| 6:00 PM CT | ||
| Radio: 620 WTMJ TV: FSN Wisconsin |
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| Probable starters: | ||
| Brandon Jennings |
PG |
D.J. Augustin |
| Stephen Jackson | SG | Gerald Henderson |
| Mike Dunleavy | SF | Corey Maggette |
| Ersan Ilyasova | PF | D.J. White |
| Andrew Bogut | C | Boris Diaw |
| (30th) 101.6 - OFFENSE - 103.4 (26th) |
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| (4th) 102.5 - DEFENSE - 107.8 (17th) |
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| (25th) 89.8 - PACE - 89.6 (26th) | ||
Linkage: Rufus on Fire / Bobcats Planet / Bobcats Baseline / JS Online
The Milwaukee Bucks and Charlotte Bobcats open the 11/12 season in Charlotte, just six months after the three team draft day trade that sent Stephen Jackson and Shaun Livingston to Milwaukee and Corey Maggette to Charlotte.
Action Jackson. While Stephen Jackson is expected to make his Bucks debut despite lingering back issues, the Bucks could be without Luc Mbah a Moute (knee tendinitis), Carlos Delfino (sprained right wrist) and Tobias Harris(dehydration), all of whom missed practice this weekend. Harris' situation is particularly baffling given he first suffered from dehydration nearly three weeks ago, yet still can't seem to get a practice in.
Delfino's absence would pave the way for Mike Dunleavy to start at small forward, while Mbah a Moute's unavailability would seem to give Drew Gooden the inside track at power forward. But who knows? Gooden is also the Bucks' most obvious choice to back up Andrew Bogut, so it's certainly possible Skiles could take a different route at PF with Ersan Ilyasova, Jon Brockman, Jon Leuer and Larry Sanders also at his disposal. As much as people may not be thrilled about it, something tells me we'll see Brockman at some point on Monday night.
Update: Ted Davis tweets that Ilyasova will start at PF, making Gooden the likely backup center off the bench. One obvious benefit of starting Ilyasova is that his ability as a floor spacer could be especially useful if the Bobcats are forced to double Bogut early. With a D.J. White/Boris Diaw front line that's more likely to happen.
Youth Movement. Michael Jordan signaled his intention to rebuild the Bobcats when he dealt Gerald Wallace last spring, tempering expectations in the short term. To wit: the Bobcats are looking for Maggette to be the club's leader in both the scoring column and in the locker room, which has never boded well for a team's playoff chances. No matter--that's not what Jordan is most concerned at the moment anyway. Paul Silas is likely to start recent lottery picks D.J. Augustin and Gerald Henderson in the backcourt, with newest Baby Bobs Bismack Biyombo and Kemba Walker expected to come off the bench to start the season.
Walker struggled from the field (4/13 fg, 9/11 ft) but still managed 18 points in his debut, a 79-77 win over theHawks. He followed that with a quieter eight points in 11 minutes of the Bobs' 92-75 loss in Atlanta, but all indications are that he'll get plenty of minutes. Meanwhile, Biyombo almost wasn't a Bobcat at all this season due to a contract dispute with Spanish club Fuenlabrada, earning his freedom only after agreeing to pay the majority of his $1.5 million buyout himself.
B.J. vs. D.J. As for the starting point guards, Augustin and Brandon Jennings took turns smoking one another last season, with Jennings recording his first career triple-double in November and averaging 26.0 ppg, 7.0 rpg and 7.3 apg on .464/.458/.938 shooting in three games against the Bobcats. Unfortunately, he also had one of his most forgettable moments of the season in Charlotte on March 28, missing eight straight shots in the final quarter including three layups in the final 12 seconds of an 87-86 loss that essentially slammed the door on the Bucks' playoff chances. Meanwhile, Augustin had some of his best outings of the season against the Bucks with 20.7 ppg, 6.5 apg and 4.0 rpg on .536/.455/1.000 shooting. The addition of Walker suggests the Bobcats probably weren't sold on Augustin as their long-term solution at the point, but to his credit he is coming off a productive bounce-back year in 10/11.
Bogut vs.... Silas isn't likely to start the 19-year-old Biyombo early on, but his other pivot options aren't ideal: PF Boris Diaw started the first preseason game, while DeSagana Diop is still playing his way into shape after coming to camp 25 pounds overweight following a ruptured Achilles last season. Tyrus Thomas also figures to be part of the starting frontcourt equation when healthy, but he's a question mark for the opener after missing game two with a sprained ankle (and he's also not a center). The Bobs also picked up Thunder misfit B.J. Mullens this week for a 2013 second rounder while dumping veteran space-eater Melvin Ely.
Until further notice I'll guess Diop starts against Bogut, but Silas could go with a small-ball approach and use Diaw as well. (Update: Consensus at the moment seems like SIlas will take his chances with Diaw attempting to mark Bogut). Like Skiles, Silas has spoken of wanting to push the pace this season, so small lineups would seem to be in order.
Livingston I presume? Shaun Livingston was a largely overlooked part of the draft day blockbuster, and it's still not clear exactly how he'll fit into the Bucks' PG-heavy backcourt rotation. Livingston played the majority of his minutes last year at the point (where he was also more effective), but he'll likely have a better opportunity to find time in Milwaukee at shooting guard next to either Brandon Jennings or Beno Udrih.
Most know Livinsgton for his uncommon combination of size (6'7") and court vision, and Bucks fans got an early taste of his slashing ability with a couple nice attacking moves to the rim in the preseason opener against Minnesota. It's no fluke: with 19 dunks in 1261 minutes, Livingston was among the league's leading dunkers from the point guard position a year ago, recording more slams per minute than the likes of Derrick Rose and John Wall. He's also developed an extremely potent post game, using his length to turn over either shoulder effectively from 10-15 feet. Which is good, because he made just one three-pointer and 32 of 101 shots from outside 15 feet last season.
The Bobcats were also dramatically better defensively with Livingston on the court last season (8.0 fewer pts/100 possessions), and as things currently stand he may well be the Bucks' best backcourt defender. So it stands to reason that Skiles will do what he can to get Livingston on the court, particularly given how he would seem to complement the shot-happy nature of Jennings and Udrih.
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Here we go again
Ok, hi again from Norway! LAst season was a bit disappointing, but being a bucks fan is about being an optimist.
Even though I said the same last year, I like the looks of the team this year. Sure, you can list concerns, but I think we have some good options, and if things were to click we could have a good season.
Anyway, look forward to some good chats here during the games, do we still have CDR and his supporters?
I think I know what Tobias Harris needed in his stocking yesterday...
Honestly, what could possibly be going on where someone is that dehydrated for so long? Is there some sort of unforeseen ailment in play?
http://twitter.com/WhalesLarry ...but only if you want to see someone still trying to figure Twitter out.
by Mitchell Maurer on Dec 26, 2011 6:42 AM CST reply actions
Here's my guess...
Skiles is making sure his young guys learn to prepare like professionals. Those young players need to be energetic to make up for the mental mistakes they will make, so I bet try are forced to run more than the other players. Whether because of more mistakes in practice or just tough love, I think sanders and Harris are earning their roster spot with Skiles the hard way…Leuer had previous professional exposure, so his stability makes sense, the only guy my theory doesn’t explain away is Hobson.
SB Nation Brew Hoop - Editor | SB Nation Midwest News Desk Contributor | SB Nation Chicago - Writer | Twitter: @stevevonhorn
by Steve von Horn on Dec 26, 2011 8:48 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
I dont recall Sanders having these issues last year
Or did he? Maybe the vets are making the youngsters gnaw on salt licks.
I never use a big word when a diminutive word would suffice.
by TheJay on Dec 26, 2011 8:51 AM CST via Android app up reply actions
This year is different with the compressed practice schedule and game schedule.
If your young players can’t be counted on for energy, you are in trouble as a coach. I’d guess he’s trying to work them into condition even higher than a normal season because of the back to backs and few rest days
SB Nation Brew Hoop - Editor | SB Nation Midwest News Desk Contributor | SB Nation Chicago - Writer | Twitter: @stevevonhorn
by Steve von Horn on Dec 26, 2011 8:54 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
Dehydration?
Anyone know of other players who have gone dry so long? I don’t. I wondered if that could be a cover to hold them out ‘cuz they were going to be traded, but that doesn’t sound convincing.
This forum could use a designated doctor.
My wife (in UW medical school and a former D-3 athlete) has offered the following reason for the recurring problem, and it makes the most sense:
They are going out drinking too much. Drink the night before, and alcohol has a diuretic effect.
Too much drinker for the young guys? Sounds about right to me…
SB Nation Brew Hoop - Editor | SB Nation Midwest News Desk Contributor | SB Nation Chicago - Writer | Twitter: @stevevonhorn
by Steve von Horn on Dec 26, 2011 9:16 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
That's not a good omen
I hope that your wife is wrong.
That being said, it’s completely reasonable conclusion to draw. If it’s true, how long will it take until the Vin Baker comparisons come up?
http://twitter.com/WhalesLarry ...but only if you want to see someone still trying to figure Twitter out.
by Mitchell Maurer on Dec 26, 2011 10:07 AM CST up reply actions
Rich young men drinking too much...
Guess I view that as just something that happens on the way to maturity. Doesn’t need to be a problem. Might be a fond memory.
Only a few lose their balance (like Baker) and slide down the slippery slope.
I myself won’t open a concern ticket on this one unless there are repeated incidents.
I don’t drink alcohol any more but I realize that most young men do. The world goes on.
Is it just me, but does this now conjure visions of some possible “epic” evening where the disappointing Larry was a bad influence on young Tobias? An off-court incident that management has klept very, very quiet (with the loyal & lazy support of the J-S)? If that happened to be the case, it might point a finger at the team’s next roster move.
The other thing this does is point out the staff shortcomings at BrewHoop. Based on appearances, you have no female reporters. If you had one, and if she chose to sleep with one of the players, you would have inside info…
Female reporters, eh?
I know wifey won’t do it, but I have a slender build and little to no dignity, and I could pull this off…
http://twitter.com/WhalesLarry ...but only if you want to see someone still trying to figure Twitter out.
by Mitchell Maurer on Dec 26, 2011 10:41 AM CST up reply actions
I'd be very surprised if that was the explanation
Harris is 19 and a huge part of the basis for drafting him was his maturity—is he really getting lit up his first weekend of practices in the NBA? And is that going to keep him in and out of practice for two weeks? I’ll give them the benefit of the doubt, though if we assume that then I’m not sure what’s going on with the Bucks’ training staff.
by Frank Madden on Dec 26, 2011 10:55 AM CST up reply actions
News Flash
Tobias Harris a bumbling alcholic Hear it here first
Wow
"He always plays like he's a pit bull that hasn't been fed in about a year and that you've got pork chops in your pockets and that's the basketball." Of course, he's Canadian
by CanadaBucks on Dec 26, 2011 11:03 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
As a UU
I welcome all gender choices and practices (at least the ones I’m at least vaguely aware of) to the Big Tent of Human Diversity. But your proposed selfless sacrifice is too complex for me to comment on. Perhaps you should work out a plan with Frank and the staff.
Dammit link fail
this YouTube was supposed to be attached
http://twitter.com/WhalesLarry ...but only if you want to see someone still trying to figure Twitter out.
by Mitchell Maurer on Dec 26, 2011 11:20 AM CST up reply actions
SWGA
Reminds me of SVGA which was a great thing when PCs jumped from 2 colours to 8 or w/e it was 25 or so years ago.
"He always plays like he's a pit bull that hasn't been fed in about a year and that you've got pork chops in your pockets and that's the basketball." Of course, he's Canadian
by CanadaBucks on Dec 26, 2011 11:57 AM CST up reply actions
re: Livingston
Most know Livinsgton for his uncommon combination of size (6’7") and court vision, and Bucks fans got an early taste of his slashing ability with a couple nice attacking moves to the rim in the preseason opener…He’s also developed an extremely potent post game, using his length to turn over either shoulder effectively from 10-15 feet.
Somebody tell me why he’s not in the running to get 20+ minutes at the 2/3 every night. I know his knee issues limit his endurance (not conditioning-wise, but movement-wise), but a player like this would do wonders in a lineup with good spot-up shooters (Jennings, Delfino, Dunleavy, even Ersan and Jackson) and a decent big man (Bogut and Gooden 25% of the time).
Honestly, Livingston should be the centerpiece of our second unit. Put everyone in a specific role around him and let him go to work.
http://twitter.com/WhalesLarry ...but only if you want to see someone still trying to figure Twitter out.
by Mitchell Maurer on Dec 26, 2011 6:48 AM CST reply actions
If Delfino, Moute, and Harris are all out
I’m sure he will get 20+ minutes tonight. The only other option at back-up wing all night will be Hobson and I don’t expect to see him at all tonight unless Skiles just wants to get out some jitters in garbage time.
I have an acronym for Hobson
TGUP
Talent Getting Unexpected Participation
(Downbeat used TDWR for Talent Deserving Wider Recognition, that’s the source.)
Interpretation: I think Skiles will find more minutes for Hobson (unless he’s D Leagued) than fans expect. Like he does for Brockman. I think Hobson works at moving the offense and anticipates on both ends (in addition to visible rookie mistakes). If the mid-sized players ahead of Hobson produce, Hobson may become a man without a portfolio. But I think he also has a chance to be somewhere in the rotation if there are injuries or struggles. At some point.
I agree with your take on Hobson
There’s few other possible reasons for why the organization waived him last year but still found a way to keep him around and re-sign him. They recognize his ability is beyond that of his peers, and once he gets a chance to refine it he could be a valuable player.
Harris has a similar reputation, but his status as a first-round pick makes him higher profile by default.
http://twitter.com/WhalesLarry ...but only if you want to see someone still trying to figure Twitter out.
by Mitchell Maurer on Dec 26, 2011 11:57 AM CST up reply actions
No pressure guys but
This is a “should” win, important if we hope to contend for a playoff spot. Charlotte may be the worst team in the NBA this yeat and I think we need to try to pound it inside to take advantage of what should be a superior front line.
"He always plays like he's a pit bull that hasn't been fed in about a year and that you've got pork chops in your pockets and that's the basketball." Of course, he's Canadian
If we don't win this game we are in serious trouble...
We match up well against this team and they are littered with young, inexperienced guys…
Yep
I mean, losing this game isn’t a death sentence in term of the whole season (it’s still just one game), but it’s definitely a game that the Bucks should handle with moderate ease if they really are an improved team. Just looking at the starting lineups, there’s little doubt Milwaukee has more talent on the roster, but there’s always the chance nobody on the team will be able to shoot a lick. It’d be nice to start the season strong considering the fairly weak schedule, get a little confidence going.
by Dan Sinclair on Dec 26, 2011 10:21 AM CST up reply actions
if they win
and look good doing so, it will exemplify the changes they’ve talked about and that we’re hoping for. More versatile, more active offense. Jackson having a unifying influence. Jennings and Bogut asserting.
if they lose it’ll just mean (to me) that all those things won’t happen immediately, but may in time.
Agreed that on paper this should be a win
Coming off a regular preseason I’d feel a bit better, but the Bucks do have a number of new faces and I have no idea how close they are to getting on the same page. Can say the same and then some about the Bobs, but more variability is always better for the underdog.
by Frank Madden on Dec 26, 2011 10:59 AM CST up reply actions
All I really want to see this season, since we are stuck on the mediocrity treadmill anyways, is...
for Jennings to take the next step into becoming a borderline all star and for Leuer or some other unexpected young guy to also take steps towards being good… With the current makeup of this team we certainly can sneak into the playoffs to be smashed my the Heat or some other talented team but until we add a little more star power, which most likely has to happen with the young guys we do have, we are nothing more than a borderline playoff team
Bucks definitely need their assets to appreciate in value
Even if the current iteration of the Bucks isn’t ticketed for contention anytime soon, there is no downside to Jennings and other young players taking the next steps in their evolution. Would love to see Leuer, Harris and/or Sanders become real contributors, though the latter two are going to be hamstrung by their inability to stay hydrated.
by Frank Madden on Dec 26, 2011 11:03 AM CST up reply actions
I find myself a rebel in service to the establishment...
I suspect nothing good will happen for the Bucks franchise in Milwaukee until they have a winning season based on a team that casual fans think is entertaining and pretty good (doesn’t have to be great right now). Yes, we had a winning and stirring season 2 years ago, but that was so out-of-the-blue that when last year came along to follow, casual fans just scowled and said “Same old Bucks… Not worth a damn.”
So this season needs to be playoffs, and the next season needs to be playoffs +.
Fans desperate to build for a championship hate the idea of getting mediocre because that normally makes it harder to get very good. But I think the city has zero tolerance for a Bucks tank — getting bad for a few years to give us a better chance at one or more prime players.
So, personally, I find myself “embracing” the thing I despise: mediocrity. If our GM is the smart Hammond, I think he could pass thorough Mediocre on his way to Contending. If our GM is the dumb Hammonds, then either Herb Kohl will try someone else, or the franchise will be gone.
That's a good point
And I think I’d rather have mediocrity than really bad seasons anyway. I’d like to think anything can happen once you reach the playoffs too, I know it’s unlikely but there’s always hope.
"He always plays like he's a pit bull that hasn't been fed in about a year and that you've got pork chops in your pockets and that's the basketball." Of course, he's Canadian
by CanadaBucks on Dec 26, 2011 10:12 AM CST up reply actions
Bucks need success to attract positive attention
I’m with you guys on being frustrated by mediocrity, but the Bucks probably aren’t bad enough to get a top-3 or even top-5 pick this year, so why not try to win back some disgruntled fans? With the arena issue pressing more each year, it can’t hurt to give the people something to cheer about. Baseball’s a totally different animal, but just winning a good number of games a few years in a row has done wonders for the Brewers’ popularity.
by Dan Sinclair on Dec 26, 2011 10:25 AM CST up reply actions
It's not fit for the current bucks, but the theory of the tank job is great.
It’s presumably a short term sell on the tank, then you have a top prospect to tout to fans and the city.
Look at Cleveland. I think different about them now than I did mid last season. They have blue chip prospects and hope now…it wouldnt be a difficult sell if they ever really went for it, in my opinion. By the time the draft rolls around fans get the whole point very quickly.
SB Nation Brew Hoop - Editor | SB Nation Midwest News Desk Contributor | SB Nation Chicago - Writer | Twitter: @stevevonhorn
by Steve von Horn on Dec 26, 2011 1:44 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
a new owner
…would have the honeymoon period to say: “We want to bring a championship to Milwaukee. We’re going to concentrate on The Future. Not on vets who already have developed but on young players who will develop. Right now, we may lose more than we win, but we’ll be growing before your eyes. We’ll always play hard, we’ll be fun to watch, and we’ll be laying the foundation to bring a championship to Milwaukee.”
That would be believable coming from Mark Attanasio or another new owner. At the risk of being unfair, it would be hard for me to believe that coming from Mr. Herb Kohl given the team’s history under him.
My [after] X-mas wish....
BJ continues to be what he’s been – Beno & Livingston have great seasons – Bogut bounces back – Bucks go 33-33 and lose in the 1st round of playoffs…..
Fast forward to Summer 2012…… Bucks sign Eric Gordon, Beno, and Livingston to long term deals and trade BJ and Jax for the draft rights to Anthony Davis.
Yup, that’d make me a happy Bucks fan ; )
Eric Gordon would be an excellent fit
and I’m definitely in favor of keeping Livingston long-term, and I’d be OK with finding a way to get Anthony Davis (as long as he’d play at the 3, he’s too stringy for the 4). I want to keep Jennings, but I am on the opposite side of the BJ spectrum from you, so no surprise there.
But I doubt the team even sniffs Gordon as a FA. Just doesn’t seem like a fit.
http://twitter.com/WhalesLarry ...but only if you want to see someone still trying to figure Twitter out.
by Mitchell Maurer on Dec 26, 2011 10:26 AM CST up reply actions
Davis
I’m not really that excited about him, partly because like you said he should be a 3 but I’m not sure if he can. He’s really young of course but his offense has a long way to go, unless your talking about tip-ins and dunks. And his uni-brow bothers me.
Montee Ball didn't win the Heisman. F__ everybody.
Tajh Boyd and Dre' Ellington are the future.
by BlackPack-fan on Dec 26, 2011 1:20 PM CST up reply actions
His eyebrows make Joe Flacco look like a male model.
But his offense is atrocious. I think it’s going to take him a long time to really figure out what he can and can’t do. Going from 6’3" to 6’10" in 2 years does wonders for one’s defense but ruins jump shots. Shoot, I’m surprised his hand-eye coordination isn’t awful.
http://twitter.com/WhalesLarry ...but only if you want to see someone still trying to figure Twitter out.
by Mitchell Maurer on Dec 26, 2011 1:34 PM CST up reply actions
I agree Anthony Davis is raw - and his growth spurt is almost bizzare
But he has PG skills/mentality in a 6’ 10" body – and is already an incredible shot blocker, more because of his timing and anticipation than his physical skills.
Though the uni-brow is troubling…
And he runs the floor like a deer [pun intended]
Of all the current college studs, he and Drummond interest me the most.
Mainly because dominant big men are so hard to find. And they’re both supposed to be high character guys…. which is even harder to find when dealing w/ blue-chip prospects IMO.
My biggest concern with Davis' NBA prospects
He went from PG in high school to 4/5, and he’s playing a 4/5 right now at Kentucky.
If he stays in school and works on his game close to the basket or turns himself into a wing instead of a forward (a Lamar Odom-type 3), he’ll have a better chance of making an impact when he gets drafted.
I doubt he’ll stay in school (why risk it?), so he’ll get drafted by a terrible team and will probably expect/be expected to play significant minutes on day 1. But where does he play? He’s not a good enough shooter to play outside and he’s definitely not strong enough to play inside. Plus, his admittedly-impressive ball handling skills will leave him with less of an advantage once matched up with NBA athletes of similar size.
So, yes, he will improve with time, but I think this is one of the (rare) cases where a player would legitimately improve more in college than in the NBA. Why let him get beat up for the first 2-3 years in the league and potentially ruin his confidence (a la Darko Milicic)?
And no, I’m not a Davis hater. I once wrote this, but I’ve just thought about it more lately, and I am more cautious as to how he would fare if he makes the jump this offseason.
http://twitter.com/WhalesLarry ...but only if you want to see someone still trying to figure Twitter out.
by Mitchell Maurer on Dec 26, 2011 2:16 PM CST up reply actions
Gordon & Davis
Davis is going to be a star in the NBA, he’s 20…he will fill out. I don’t think it’s unlikely that the Bucks bid on Gordon in FA next year if they think NO isn’t going to match, I do think it’s unlikely that NO lets him go in FA tho.
My beef with Gordon
I want SG Shabazz Muhammed, 2013 #1 overall pick. I don’t care how we go about getting that kid into a Bucks uniform, but if you want the right #1 pick in the right draft, 2013 is the one to have it in.
His versatility is impressive
But I’d love to see footage of him using his off-hand for anything. Way too much reliance on the dominant hand.
http://twitter.com/WhalesLarry ...but only if you want to see someone still trying to figure Twitter out.
by Mitchell Maurer on Dec 26, 2011 2:26 PM CST up reply actions
You're probably right about Gordon, MM.
I dig his overall game – and he seems like the under-the-radar kind of “star” that a team like the Bucks could obtain – but you’re prob right that it won’t happen.
We all know big name, marquee FAs will never come here….
I remain stubborn...
…in thinking that good FAs will come here IF (and that’s the big IF) this franchise changes its image (based on reality) from The Little Engine That Can’t to The Little Engine That Can.
That means winning more than losing. Means playing team basketball — the kind that smart players enjoy and contribute to. The Bucks have been both bad and boring (for the players). That won’t attract anyone.
Now, most superstars and a lot of stars will want the outside financial opportunities of the glamor teams, and the big city culture, and the fail-safe security of being on rich teams surrounded by other stars. I’m foolish, but not sufficiently so to deny that.
But we don’t need to attract anything more that a FEW very good players. And if the Bucks play hoops “the right way” there will be very good players who would like to be part of that and would like to raise their family in a small city like Milwaukee — which really is convenient and which has a more peaceful pace that fits some individuals.
All good points, Chuk...
There are some “stars” that don’t mind playing in a smaller market.
But Milw is a unique situation, based on the teams woeful winning % the past 20 yrs, and the notion [fairly or not] that Milw is a hick town w/ little – nothing to do…
The team can’t just “refurb” its image — get it back to what it normally is. As you say, Bucks normal has been bad. They’ll have to Change the image.
When you have the money NBA athletes have, Milwaukee is pretty damn close to Chicago. Hell, they can hire a limo and a driver to attend any big city cultural activities they wish to.
On the other end, it’s not rare for athletes to come from small town situations, and find their families and their hunting, fishing, and outside activities much more meaningful than big-city flash.
Not trying to “win” this discussion. Just offering my view.
Via the Bucks' Facebook page
Ersan Ilyasova is getting the start at PF over Drew Gooden.
Any thoughts on whether this is a good move or not?
http://twitter.com/WhalesLarry ...but only if you want to see someone still trying to figure Twitter out.
by Mitchell Maurer on Dec 26, 2011 12:09 PM CST reply actions
I'm fine with it.
One of the things Skiles’ teams rely on is outside shooting, and that lineup certainly provides it. That assumes that Ersan will be better then last year though…
by Jacob Grinyer on Dec 26, 2011 12:28 PM CST up reply actions
mildly surprised
but not inclined to make much of it
Ersan hasn’t looked very good, but maybe a start will help.
Do they want Gooden at both C and PF?
If Bobs are seriously going with Diaw at center then there’s a good chance they double Bogut in the post…and if that happens you’ll want shooters like Ersan on the court. Really need Bogut to punish the single teams tonight.
by Frank Madden on Dec 26, 2011 12:47 PM CST via iPhone app up reply actions
"shooters like Ersan"
I hope to get back to thinking of Ersan like that
(although I don’t recall how he did as a shooter in the advanced stats analysis — think it was’t particularly good)
He was one of the best in the league in terms of long twos (48%, see rankings) but poor on threes.
by Frank Madden on Dec 26, 2011 4:35 PM CST up reply actions
In other words, he can hit euro threes. That's my theory on him. Don't mess with his euro line, just let him do it.
SB Nation Brew Hoop - Editor | SB Nation Midwest News Desk Contributor | SB Nation Chicago - Writer | Twitter: @stevevonhorn
by Steve von Horn on Dec 26, 2011 4:53 PM CST up reply actions
That is great news in my opinion...
Gooden is better served with the second unit where him taking many shots isn’t cannibalizing Boguts/Jaxs production… Ersan spaces the floor well and allows us to put Moute at the 3 where he goes from really good to elite defender…
Oh Boy
The two worst offenses last year clash in a battle for the title of mediocre. I am so excited to see (maybe, I dunno if I can find a stream in Guatemala) the Bucks play real NBA basketball, but I have a feeling that the organization is treading water.
Predicted lines:
Jennings 14 pts, 7 assists, 2 rebs, 4-13, 5-7 from the line
Bogut 12 pts, 10 rebs, 1 block, 3-10 from the line
Jackson 13 pts, no rebounds, 2 assists, 1 three
Mbah a Moute 7 pts, 6 boards, 2 stls, 1 blk
Dunleavy 14 pts, 5-10, 2 threes, an assist or two
We need creators and I’m not sure right now where that’s coming from. We can hope for health and surprise from rookies, but I don’t see a huge space for improvement. This season will be an exhilarating grind.
We need creators and I’m not sure right now where that’s coming from.
Shawn Livingston. And maybe Jennings.
http://twitter.com/WhalesLarry ...but only if you want to see someone still trying to figure Twitter out.
by Mitchell Maurer on Dec 26, 2011 1:18 PM CST up reply actions
Jennings double-double tonight
15+ pts, 10+ ast
DRINKING GAME>>>
During the ESPN Pre-season Show, and again during yesterdays TNT PreSeason Show I thought it would be great fun to have a drink / shot each time the Bucks or a Bucks personnel player/coach was mentioned.
In both cases the hour came and went, and the glass remained dry; not a murmur of anything Milwaukee stated during either hour. .
Meanwhile, in corner saloons across the greater Milwaukee area rumors of Tobias Harris are greatly exaggerated. Drinking in Milwaukee? Who Told?
CanadaBucks will go shot to shot with Tobias Harris playing this game
http://twitter.com/WhalesLarry ...but only if you want to see someone still trying to figure Twitter out.
by Mitchell Maurer on Dec 26, 2011 1:11 PM CST up reply actions
Well Tobias wins hands down
I’m the only Canadian who doesn’t drink
"He always plays like he's a pit bull that hasn't been fed in about a year and that you've got pork chops in your pockets and that's the basketball." Of course, he's Canadian
Hey, during the Lakers game Hubie Brown said to watch out for the Bucks
Which basically means we’re doomed. In order for us to be good, nobody has to expect us. We’re like the Spanish Inquisition that way.
by Jacob Grinyer on Dec 26, 2011 1:59 PM CST up reply actions
NOBODY
expects the Spanish Inquisition!
http://twitter.com/WhalesLarry ...but only if you want to see someone still trying to figure Twitter out.
by Mitchell Maurer on Dec 26, 2011 2:20 PM CST up reply actions
Hubie Brown has severe pizza face
I give him no credibility because of that.
And if the Bucks are the Spanish Inquisition, their chief weapon would be defense and ????
"He always plays like he's a pit bull that hasn't been fed in about a year and that you've got pork chops in your pockets and that's the basketball." Of course, he's Canadian
How about
An almost ruthless devotion to Scott Skiles?
"He always plays like he's a pit bull that hasn't been fed in about a year and that you've got pork chops in your pockets and that's the basketball." Of course, he's Canadian
I just "independently" decided to order a delivered pizza
Honest. …and I haven’t done that for 3 years. This part of the thread MUST be responsible. The least you gentlemen could do is pass that hat and pay for the pizza. I’ll let you off easy. No bread sticks.
tell the Pizza Co. to comp you
And you’ll spread the word
"He always plays like he's a pit bull that hasn't been fed in about a year and that you've got pork chops in your pockets and that's the basketball." Of course, he's Canadian
A reference to Hubie Brown's pizza face inspired you to order a pizza?
I hope you’re not thinking of Hubie while eating it.
by Frank Madden on Dec 26, 2011 4:37 PM CST up reply actions
Chuk is living proof that
Subliminal messaging works. I too am a a bit worried about the bromance with Hubie though.
"He always plays like he's a pit bull that hasn't been fed in about a year and that you've got pork chops in your pockets and that's the basketball." Of course, he's Canadian
relax
i tried 4 places online. couldn’t find one that delivered. decided not to call Dominoes (not sure why). am looking at dinnering on a can of gumbo soup and a thawed bran muffin. neither should remind me of Hubie’s face (which I didn’t have an image for until you friends starting obsessing on it.)
am now trying to see if i can get Ted Davis on the radio in this house I’m sitting. so far, no go. probably available online, but didn’t bring the speakers so i’d have to listen thru the laptop’s miniature sound system.
Bold prediction
After tonight we will have our best record since being at 5-5 last year
"He always plays like he's a pit bull that hasn't been fed in about a year and that you've got pork chops in your pockets and that's the basketball." Of course, he's Canadian
Overseas timezone problem...
…as usual….how long until tip-off?
Fear the 'Dear'? You're damn right I'm scared of my wife!
Thanks Frank :)
Fear the 'Dear'? You're damn right I'm scared of my wife!
by Big Crazy Dave on Dec 26, 2011 5:13 PM CST up reply actions
I'm always here for you, Dave :)
Answering the tough questions
by Frank Madden on Dec 26, 2011 5:18 PM CST up reply actions
Predictions?
I’ll say…hmm…how about…91-84 Bucks.
Really want to see Bogut go to work against Diaw/White.
Would love to see Dunleavy stroke some early threes, maybe a little catch-and-shoot off curls, and help keep the ball moving.
Brandon just needs to get the better of Augustin.
97-85 Bucks
In a game that isnt even that close… Offense starts inside out with Bogut… shooters hit enough 3’s to help the Bucks pull ahead early and never look back…
Got me thinking of that game last year
Where Bogut had like 18 at the break, can’t remember what he did in the 2nd half but I know it wasn’t a lot
"He always plays like he's a pit bull that hasn't been fed in about a year and that you've got pork chops in your pockets and that's the basketball." Of course, he's Canadian
This is definitely the kind of team that you should be able to beat comfortably on the road
Unfortunately, I have the mindset of a Bucks fan :)
by Frank Madden on Dec 26, 2011 6:06 PM CST up reply actions
We'll take this one, 89-82
The Bobcats are just so bad, unless Kemba gets going and lights it up they won’t be able to score.
Montee Ball didn't win the Heisman. F__ everybody.
Tajh Boyd and Dre' Ellington are the future.
by BlackPack-fan on Dec 26, 2011 6:07 PM CST up reply actions
Curious to see the matchup between him and Brandon
We know they’re old buds, hopefully that motivation works in our favor and not Kemba’s…
by Frank Madden on Dec 26, 2011 6:09 PM CST up reply actions
Here's to a good season
"He always plays like he's a pit bull that hasn't been fed in about a year and that you've got pork chops in your pockets and that's the basketball." Of course, he's Canadian
by CanadaBucks on Dec 26, 2011 6:10 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
We have waited too long to see an average Bucks team play this season…and yet we’re all excited.
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Rec
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by keiththejourno on Dec 26, 2011 6:14 PM CST up reply actions
There's a joke there
But I’ll pass
"He always plays like he's a pit bull that hasn't been fed in about a year and that you've got pork chops in your pockets and that's the basketball." Of course, he's Canadian
I think we all said that last year too...
Just saying…
by Jacob Grinyer on Dec 26, 2011 6:15 PM CST up reply actions
Assist for BJ
Book it Vic
"He always plays like he's a pit bull that hasn't been fed in about a year and that you've got pork chops in your pockets and that's the basketball." Of course, he's Canadian
F'reals
But more drive and kicks. And more made layups :)
by Frank Madden on Dec 26, 2011 6:18 PM CST up reply actions
Pace is surprising
"He always plays like he's a pit bull that hasn't been fed in about a year and that you've got pork chops in your pockets and that's the basketball." Of course, he's Canadian
Interior defence and paint help defense looks pretty below par so far.
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Dear Drew Gooden,
Don’t ever let me catch you hoisting a 3 again.
Signed,
Everyone
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by keiththejourno on Dec 26, 2011 6:28 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
Did Boris Diaw eat insert player who hasn’t been seen for a while?
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*Insert here* jokes are lame...
….in an excellent way.
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by keiththejourno on Dec 26, 2011 6:29 PM CST up reply actions
ha
He’s not in the best shape of anyone’s life.
by Frank Madden on Dec 26, 2011 6:29 PM CST up reply actions
Gooden looks like he's rushing his shot
doesn’t look like he’s even got a good grip on the ball when he’s shooting
And had that great block earlier
#accentuatethepositive
by Frank Madden on Dec 26, 2011 6:31 PM CST up reply actions
If we're focusing on the positives...
…he shaved off that neckbeard from 09.
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by keiththejourno on Dec 26, 2011 6:32 PM CST up reply actions
Age old problem...
…if Gooden is shooting 16 feet jumpers, he’s not there to crash the offensive boards for his misses.
Sucks to employ Gooden.
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Remember when SARS was a thing?
Yeah, that was a killer time.
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by keiththejourno on Dec 26, 2011 6:35 PM CST up reply actions
Still remember trading away a ton of them for the allegedly rare one...
…only to find that almost everyone had a rare one and I was down a ton of Pogs.
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by keiththejourno on Dec 26, 2011 6:36 PM CST up reply actions
HAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA – Corey Magette.
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Shaun Livingston has a grizzly bear carpet in his room. The bear isn’t dead it is just afraid to move.
Screw Chuck Norris.
We have Shaun Livingston.
by Jacob Grinyer on Dec 26, 2011 6:42 PM CST up reply actions
Bananas
Took it away from another NBA player!
by Frank Madden on Dec 26, 2011 6:40 PM CST up reply actions
I'll take that taunt
my reaction to that dunk definitely woulda got us a T
It was almost worth it :)
Sanders not playing like crap = lovely.
by Frank Madden on Dec 26, 2011 6:46 PM CST up reply actions
See above comment for my declaration of love
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by keiththejourno on Dec 26, 2011 6:48 PM CST up reply actions
Udrih shoots a 3 like its from half court
he needs to stop shooting that
Big bonus
Nice to see Larry repaying Skiles’ faith…
by Frank Madden on Dec 26, 2011 6:51 PM CST up reply actions
Gives us some much needed athleticism as well.
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by keiththejourno on Dec 26, 2011 6:51 PM CST up reply actions
Now we just need him to keep his arms straight up and stop swatting
so he can stay in the game.
We all know it but..
I’d like to take a moment and mention that Shaun Livingston’s knee exploded and imploded at the same time whilst as a Clipper and yet he is still playing, and playing well, today.
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Livingston looks good
Doesn’t look like anyone has their 3-point range yet.
I never use a big word when a diminutive word would suffice.
Remember when Boris Diaw wasn't overweight and was useful?
Yeah, I’m struggling to remember that too..
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You just know that for Maggette’s lob, even if the ‘Cats lose, he’s still thinking it was a really good game.
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That buzzer beater by Jennings makes my blood boil for it’s plain stupidity….but seeing as it went in I guess it was a good shot.
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Last second shot though...it happens
I’m more worried about the early clock long twos…had one of those earlier.
by Frank Madden on Dec 26, 2011 7:08 PM CST up reply actions
Overall he's played okay.
Not sure on the numbers but it felt like the team was better when Livingston was on the floor though
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by keiththejourno on Dec 26, 2011 7:09 PM CST up reply actions
Anyone have the points in paint handy?
Gotta think the Bucks doing ok there
"He always plays like he's a pit bull that hasn't been fed in about a year and that you've got pork chops in your pockets and that's the basketball." Of course, he's Canadian
Stephen Jackson looks like he’s struggling running…looked like he was jogging gingerly.
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Could be mistaken though
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by keiththejourno on Dec 26, 2011 7:24 PM CST up reply actions
Trying to get himself into the game somehow
He’s moving so slow
Wow offensive foul on Maggette
Who woulda thunk
"He always plays like he's a pit bull that hasn't been fed in about a year and that you've got pork chops in your pockets and that's the basketball." Of course, he's Canadian
This is where we need a run
"He always plays like he's a pit bull that hasn't been fed in about a year and that you've got pork chops in your pockets and that's the basketball." Of course, he's Canadian
That's exactly what most Charlotte fans are thinking about Diop and Diaw...
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by keiththejourno on Dec 26, 2011 7:30 PM CST up reply actions
Hey BJ is 40% on the year
"He always plays like he's a pit bull that hasn't been fed in about a year and that you've got pork chops in your pockets and that's the basketball." Of course, he's Canadian
Everyone > Maggette > Eddy Curry > Olowokandi
by MadTown Hoops on Dec 26, 2011 7:31 PM CST up reply actions
Corrected:
Everyone > McRib > Maggette > Eddy Curry > Olowokandi
by Frank Madden on Dec 26, 2011 7:32 PM CST up reply actions
Actually IMO
Candy Man>McRib but that’s just me
"He always plays like he's a pit bull that hasn't been fed in about a year and that you've got pork chops in your pockets and that's the basketball." Of course, he's Canadian
I'd love to see how often Maggette does something other than shoot when he has the ball.
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This is ugly
"He always plays like he's a pit bull that hasn't been fed in about a year and that you've got pork chops in your pockets and that's the basketball." Of course, he's Canadian
Commentators with the comment of the day: “One of the reasons we show the games in HD” while showing the cheerleaders.
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Correct.
I thought it was the best thing I’ve heard all day.
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by keiththejourno on Dec 26, 2011 7:38 PM CST up reply actions
Our bench>their bench so if we can keep the lead on their starters
"He always plays like he's a pit bull that hasn't been fed in about a year and that you've got pork chops in your pockets and that's the basketball." Of course, he's Canadian
Yank Dunleavy pl0x
"He always plays like he's a pit bull that hasn't been fed in about a year and that you've got pork chops in your pockets and that's the basketball." Of course, he's Canadian
Every Bobcat miss seems like a long rebound
So frustrating.
I don’t like pulling Bogut right there. Gooden/Sanders doesn’t give me a lot of confidence…
Any ideas how many offensive rebounds the Cats have gotten this quarter?
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by keiththejourno on Dec 26, 2011 7:44 PM CST up reply actions
I'm not sure how that was a flagrant two
Seemed like you could easily say that he was trying to go at the ball.
Geez
I look away and the game gets out of hand. Given my attention span, that doesn’t bode well for the season.
I never use a big word when a diminutive word would suffice.
I would like to go on record as saying that this is the worst 3rd quarter of the Bucks 2011 season so far.
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I would like to go on record as saying that this is the worst3rdquarter of the Bucks 2011 season so far.
FTFY
"I was so drunk I thought a tube of toothpaste was astronaut food"
My Twittah!
har!
Another good buzzer shot by Jennings. He had an open man right there!
Matt Carrol just outhustled the entire Bucks team.
FML.
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I mean we gave Charlotte momentum and the crowd energy, shudder
by MadTown Hoops on Dec 26, 2011 8:03 PM CST up reply actions
I dislike Scott Skiles with a very large passion
His substitution patterns are as bad as always
No I want less Skiles
which tends to come with more points
Year three blues huh
Don’t worry, no coach could make this team good
by MadTown Hoops on Dec 26, 2011 8:10 PM CST up reply actions
maybe you could use a picture of three dollar bills?
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by Steve von Horn on Dec 26, 2011 8:12 PM CST via iPhone app up reply actions
‘Diaw sat for a long time….’
Because he couldn’t get off his seat?
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Stephen Jackson, I dislike you immensely. Pleaee leAve the team with a minimum of fuss.
I mean it.
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Too late to use the amnesty?
Fear the 'Dear'? You're damn right I'm scared of my wife!
by Big Crazy Dave on Dec 26, 2011 8:16 PM CST up reply actions
Frank getting all Johnny Mac on us!!!!! YES.
SB Nation Brew Hoop - Editor | SB Nation Midwest News Desk Contributor | SB Nation Chicago - Writer | Twitter: @stevevonhorn
by Steve von Horn on Dec 26, 2011 8:19 PM CST via iPhone app up reply actions
Quick move by Bogut.
Moved before the defence could set. I liked that.
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Beno's not a good defender
But I agree, he played it about as well could be expected. Needed a big man to help and swat it…
by Frank Madden on Dec 26, 2011 8:20 PM CST up reply actions
I...AM...GONNA...BITE...MY...NAILS...DOWN...TO...THE....QUICK
Fear the 'Dear'? You're damn right I'm scared of my wife!
Not much can be done about that.
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Can only assume Bucks told Jennings he could take early shot given the clock
But yeah, tough to feel good about that look.
so they go 2-for1 and get that shot...AND foul anyways?
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by Steve von Horn on Dec 26, 2011 8:23 PM CST via iPhone app reply actions
Got a chance...missed ft..
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i hate our team... we are facing arguably the worst team in the league and lose this...
yet we wont be bad enough to actually get an impact player
That was a nasty, filthy, dirty way to lose.
Brandon Jennings long two is the stuff nightmares are made of.
Credit the team for fighting their way back into it but that was a grim way to try and win in crunch time.
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That doesn't help anything, we're just mediocre with no scorers and our point guard should not be playing in the NBA
by MadTown Hoops on Dec 26, 2011 8:30 PM CST up reply actions
Scott Skiles SUCKS
point blank period, flipping sucks
That's not really true and I don't want things to fester, he's the best coach we've had since Karl
by MadTown Hoops on Dec 26, 2011 8:33 PM CST up reply actions
Yeah, I think Skiles is better than atleast half of NBA coaches and I do like how his teams play defense...
Our problem is a general lack of star power… we have a ton of role players and thats about it
Yeah, we don't have one forward that I think any NBA fan would be comfortable starting on their team, our "depth" is made up of incomplete projects
by MadTown Hoops on Dec 26, 2011 8:38 PM CST up reply actions
What would you have done differently from Skiles?
I wish he could have done something to stem the bleeding in the third, but I don’t think the rotations lost the Bucks anything tonight.
by Frank Madden on Dec 26, 2011 8:41 PM CST up reply actions
The only thing I maybe would have tweaked would have been to run a bigger lineup with livingston and then try a few more of the iso mid-post series that worked so well in the first half.
It felt like that got passed over in the second half
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by Steve von Horn on Dec 26, 2011 8:47 PM CST up reply actions
Outside of the fact that I hate our half court sets completely
and we don’t offensive rebound at all because we’re rushing back to play defense.
3rd QTR
5:47 Charlotte Full-Time Out (Bucks 62 Bobcats 52)
3:30 Larry Sanders enters the Game for Andrew Bogut (Bucks 66 Bobcats 60)
0:00 End of QTR (Bucks 66 Bobcats 71)
They don't document momentum swings in the play by play
Momentum swang right after that time-out. So my question is what after 2 minutes and 17 seconds made Bogut need a break? A break so bad that we should pull out our defensive presence to let them carry momentum straight down the lane for an 11-0 run.
Wait wait wait I forgot to add the rest
3rd QTR
5:47 Charlotte Full-Time Out (Bucks 62 Bobcats 52)
3:30 Larry Sanders enters the Game for Andrew Bogut (Bucks 66 Bobcats 60)
3:14 Boris Diaw makes lay-up (66-62)
2:28 Kemba Walker makes 5-foot jumper plus free throw (66-65)
1:47 Byron Mullens makes tip shot (66-67)
0:45 Gerald Henderson makes layup (66-69)
0:27 Drew Gooden flagarant foul on Henderson lay-up attempt, makes FTs (66-71).
0:00 End of QTR (Bucks 66 Bobcats 71)
Is it just me or was that a jack-ass substitution?
This one bothers me because my personal preference
4TH QTR
0:20 Larry Sanders enters the game for Mike Dunleavy (Bucks 92 Bobcats 94)
0:20 Mike Dunleavy enters the game for Shaun Livingston (Bucks 92 Bobcats 94)
0:09 Kemba Walker defensive rebound (Bucks 92 Bobcats 94)
So basically Skiles decided to SUB SHAUN LIVINGSTON who played 35 minutes and logged 14/4/6 OUT for LARRY SANDERS who played 11 minutes and logged 4/4/0 for the most important offensive possession of the game. I’d argue that Livingston should have been in the game unquestioned down 2, but should have had the ball to run the offense too. Instead we get a open Dunleavy 3 (which was a good shot, but not what we needed) but followed by a KEMBA WALKER rebound. And the whole time I’m thinking why is Larry Sanders on the floor? He has absolutely no purpose out there. We needed some penetration and a inside shot. Not that 3 with no offensive rebounders
Fun first half, at the very least.
Anyone want to make any guesses as to how many games Charlotte wins this year?
by Jacob Grinyer on Dec 26, 2011 8:31 PM CST up reply actions
I like Silas and I like Kemba and Gerald but the rest of the squad makes my eyes bleed.
26 wins this season I think.
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by keiththejourno on Dec 26, 2011 8:32 PM CST up reply actions
Ew.
http://twitter.com/WhalesLarry ...but only if you want to see someone still trying to figure Twitter out.
by Mitchell Maurer on Dec 26, 2011 8:30 PM CST reply actions
oh snap, mad town with the lakers sideswipe!
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by Steve von Horn on Dec 26, 2011 8:34 PM CST up reply actions
It is an honor to have evoked an oh snap from you sir
On that note, I’m out
by MadTown Hoops on Dec 26, 2011 8:36 PM CST up reply actions
Okay Frank, queue up the picture of three dollar bills or 12 quarters or something for the Three Bucks feature..
SB Nation Brew Hoop - Editor | SB Nation Midwest News Desk Contributor | SB Nation Chicago - Writer | Twitter: @stevevonhorn
Here
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by Steve von Horn on Dec 26, 2011 8:49 PM CST up reply actions
EW.
http://twitter.com/WhalesLarry ...but only if you want to see someone still trying to figure Twitter out.
by Mitchell Maurer on Dec 26, 2011 8:44 PM CST reply actions
Well almost more like different Bucks, same year.
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by Steve von Horn on Dec 26, 2011 8:50 PM CST up reply actions
Part of the Bucks personality
…was on display in the 3rd quarter. The soft, indecisive, buck-in-the-headlights team. My guess is that we all, on some level, knew it was still there. Wasn’t at all good to watch; was way too familiar.
The 4th quarter comeback was “nice” — evidence of some kind of spunk — but not really convincing. A little luck involved. And when it looked like Charlotte had things braking their way in keeping the lead, my take was that the Bucks just weren’t strong enough to prevail.
An unnecessary loss. But not the end of any world. We knew the team has much work to do. It showed tonight. Last year’s team seemed unable to learn, unable to improve. I still hope this year’s edition will be different.
plus
We have yet to see how the Jackson 5 is going to fit in
Hey gang
Was gone during the game, listened to some of the radio after the game. Are there any positives to take from this loss?
Yep, several IMO
1) Livingston looked really good, all around
2) Bogut looked confident with his offensive moves
3) Bogut made his FTs
4) Sanders rebounding in the 1st half
Even though they didn’t have great stats, Dunleavy looked like he’ll be efficient from 3 this season and Beno looks like he’ll be efficient with 18ft. Basically they bring exactly what they were advertised to bring.
by FearTheDeer on Dec 26, 2011 10:38 PM CST up reply actions
Looked at Charlotte's starting lineup ....
Wow ..we lost o them? I think ths will be a lng season, folks. One game is one game, but this team feels lke the island of misfit toys.
my "summation" from this 1 game
Many of us were pleased when the team gathered in training camp and generally talked about intending to have better chemistry, to play stronger. Guess I thought it revealed a fresh resolve. Now I’d say that, more than anything, it revealed that they more simply knew they had weaknesses and really wanted to improve. Didn’t mean they knew HOW to improve. I think I may have been wrong in my sense that they were solidly confident they COULD make the changes.
I think they are a better team this year. But I am now quite unsure whether they know how to do what must be done. To win.
Being a WINNING basketball player is a status only some can achieve. Many more realize what needs doing, but can’t do it. If Jennings, Bogut and the aging/infirm Jackson are Our Key Three, they may not be able to give this team a winner’s mindset. Partially because of personal failures, but probably also because it just doesn’t add up. From the competitive standpoint, the personalities are incomplete.
A more positive scenario is that they ended last season as a losing team and we shouldn’t be overly alarmed that (with new pieces to fit in) they start this season showing losing traits. If they can learn and grow together, it may be playoffs in Milwaukee.
I don’t know the odds they face. My guess is that “losers” in athletics may face roughly the kind of odds that recovering addicts face. Not a piece of cake. Unlearning destructive behaviors and also learning winning behaviors ain’t easy. But it sure is worth the effort….
I just do not see a distinct plan
We surround a so-called “core” with also-ran players. When the Redd era ended, or when they knew it was on the immediate horizon, we should have foused on a pure youth movement. Instead, they succumbed to some myoptic “win now” mentality, and Voia !!! we have Gooden and Salmons and Magette and SJax and Dunleavy — and a host of foreign players who have reached their peak before we acquired them. Quite frankly, it makes me scratch my head at times. Hammonds is not THAT different than Larry Harris …he has just been a tad better than Harris within a similar paradigm.This prompts me to look for a common denominator, and that is the owner, Herb Kohl.
AND Scotty Skiles
There was a youth movement before fear the deer. Only a coach like Scott Skiles could get a group so light on development, talent, and skill to squeeze into the playoffs on effort. Only to damn ourselves in the long run starting with a 15th pick and fooling our anxious owner to encourage his award winning, yet gullible GM to believe we’re on the cusp of something special.
by FearTheDeer on Dec 27, 2011 12:36 AM CST up reply actions
The owner
…has been the “commoning” denominator for decades.
They tell me that fish rot from the head. The off-smell you detect in these Bucks comes from that direction too. But he’s the man responsible for Milwaukee having a team. And I’m convinced that he tries his best, bouncing back from failures to try again.
The Milwaukee franchise faces long odds. It’s not indifference or sheer incompetence that dooms them season after season. To put it one way, it’s the failure to be comprehensively excellent. The failure to run the organization remarkably well. Management doesn’t talk about that. It would make the team seem virtually hopeless. But close fans are “allowed” to realize that and cut the team some slack in the tries they make and the failures they experience.
Note I only said “some slack.” Good fans don’t endorse or calmly tolerate patterns of mediocrity. But then the Bucks are not content to be mediocre. They keep taking gambles to be better than that. Lately they’re losing gambles. Might be bad luck. Might more likely be that they just aren’t smarter and more savvy than the competition. Selling Milwaukee to a superb GM is probably as difficult as selling to a gifted FA.
Intention is fine, wanting to be excellent is fine, but ....
John Hammonds came from a successful organization (Detroit) but that does not mean he can automatically mImic what they did there. He did the right thng by dumping Larry Harris’ mistakes, but he has negated some of that by acquiring some of his own. Sure, he got rid of those too (Magette and Salmons), but again, can you keep looking for lightening in a bottle? All that results is a disjointed roster that has to keep findng the right chemistry. If the Bucks cannot model themseves after the big boys, they need to start looking at teams like the Bulls and the Thunder, getting the right youth THEN adding a piece here and there. If that means a tear down and rebuild, so be it.
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