NBA Draft Lottery Study: Part Two - The Current Bucks
In part one, Steve put on a clinic and broke down PER so clearly even I can understand it. Now that we know what we're dealing with stats-wise, let's see what we're dealing with personnel-wise.
As we all know, the Bucks were simply bad at scoring points. Shooting, driving, drawing fouls; every aspect of the game that focused on putting the ball in the basket ranged from poor to gaze-averting putrid. The regular stats don't lie: the team was dead last in points-per-game (91.9), dead last in overall FG percentage (.430), 28th in turnover differential (-1.7), dead last in points-per-shot (1.15), and dead last in offensive rating (101.6). Say it with me...ewwwwww.
There are so many possible reasons for this ineptitude, it's almost impossible to diagnose the root cause. One of the more popular theories (put forth by our own Alex) is that the team's pace is so slow, it limits transition opportunities and forces the team to score in the half-court, which it obviously struggles to do. Thankfully, PER adjusts for pace, and is able to tell us an individual player's efficiency relative to the rest of the league in any given season.
Part two of our study takes the stat we now know and love and applies it to the team that ended the season with an overtime victory against the Oklahoma City Thunder's second-stringers. Who's the most efficient player on the team? Who's the least? Who can we expect to improve, who will stay the same, and whose name is on the millstone weighting down the Milwaukee Bucks?
Take a deep breath, we're about to jump in...
A few preliminary clarifications are in order. First, only players who ended the regular season on the roster are being examined. Considering we'd be excluding the likes of Garrett Temple, Earl Barron, and Darington Hobson, we're not missing much.
Second, the study is limited to what we call "qualifying seasons". By our standards, a qualifying season is one in which the player plays in at least 50 games and averages at least 12.0 minutes played per game. If one of those two conditions is not met, that player's season is rendered non-qualifying for the purposes of this study. This is designed to weed out players who are too injured, too young, or too talentless to crack the rotation on a regular basis.
Third, since PER is inherently adjusted every season, we decided to look at players over a slightly more extended timeframe. Basketball is, after all, a game of trends, as is the story of most players' careers. Therefore, instead of taking a player's career average, I developed a metric that measures the 3-year PER "peak" of that player. The 3-year peak is simply the average of the season PER of the player's three highest-rated consecutive qualifying seasons. This helps us take a slightly longer view at a players' peak production over the course of his career.
For example, if a player is in the league for 6 years, but only has three seasons that match the qualifying requirements above, only those seasons are considered. Furthermore, if only two of those years are consecutive, only the two consecutive seasons are considered. This is to eliminate seasons that were mired by injury or the early years of a player's career where they're learning on the bench. One major exception to this rule is in regards to international players: players that accrue seasons in the NBA, leave for an international league, then return to the NBA have their seasons treated as consecutive, even if there is a chronological lapse in terms of NBA seasons.
Without further ado, here's what the Bucks' roster looks like in terms of PER. Brace yourselves, for what lies beyond sure ain't pretty.
| Name | Age | 3-year PER peak average | 3-year peak timeframe | Contract remaining |
| Earl Boykins | 34 | 16.97 | 2002-2005 | 0 (expired) |
| Brandon Jennings | 21 | 15.05 | 2009-2011 | 1 year (+ 2 TO) |
| Keyon Dooling | 30 | 13.10 | 2007-2010 | 1 year |
| Michael Redd | 31 | 20.77 | 2005-2008 | 0 (expired) |
| Carlos Delfino | 28 | 13.10 | 06-08, 09-10 | 0 (+1 TO) |
| John Salmons | 31 | 14.87 | 2007-2010 | 3 years (+1 TO) |
| Chris Douglas-Roberts | 24 | 11.50 | 2009-2010 | 0 (restricted FA) |
| Corey Maggette | 31 | 19.13 | 2002-2005 | 2 years |
| Luc Mbah a Moute | 24 | 11.70 | 2008-2011 | 0 (expired) |
| Ersan Ilyasova | 23 | 14.07 | 06-07, 09-11 | 1 year |
| Drew Gooden | 29 | 17.93 | 2004-2007 | 4 years |
| Larry Sanders | 22 | 11.00 | 2010-2011 | 1 year (+3 TO) |
| Jon Brockman | 24 | 12.40 | 2009-2010 | 2 years |
| Andrew Bogut | 26 | 18.70 | 2009-2011 | 3 years |
| Brian Skinner | 34 | 13.70 | 2001-2004 | 0 (expired) |
If you'll recall John Hollinger's PER reference guide, there are a few relevant benchmarks for PER. A rating of 13.0 is considered a rotation player, 15.0 is an average player, 16.5 is a solid "third option", 18.0 is a solid "second option", and 20.0 is considered a "borderline All-Star". Obviously, there are some lower marks, as well as some higher ones, but nobody on the Bucks is quite that good (or that bad).
Consider this: on the current roster, there was one player who, during their 3-year PER peak, could be considered for All-Star status. That was Michael Redd, a 31-year old shooting guard with multiple knee surgeries who hasn't been relevant since 2008. The next best is Corey Maggette, a 31-year old small forward with eleven qualifying seasons who treats defense as optional and couldn't get off Skiles' bench as a result. After that, you have Andrew Bogut (franchise centerpiece dealing with a catastrophic injury), Drew Gooden (the ever-talented space cadet who has injury concerns), Earl Boykins (5'5", 133 lbs, known as "The Squirrel"), and Brandon Jennings (promising point guard with a loud mouth and an erratic shot).
That's it. Redd, Maggette, Bogut, Gooden, Boykins, and Jennings. Those are the only players who have peaked (PER-wise) above the average mark of 15.0. And of those players, only Jennings and Bogut have a 3-year peak that occurred after 2008.
Your starting shooting guard? During his best years, he was on the cusp of being considered a "pretty good player"...but at 31 years old, it's safe to say that those years are behind him. Your starting small forward? He's a strong rotation player, but nothing more. Your de facto starting power forward? Defensive acumen aside, he is just a step above "scrounging for minutes". Three of your five starters are below average players. Let that sink in for a moment.
* * *
Some criticisms of this study (so far) surely include the age-old fact that PER does a terrible job accounting for defense. After all, the Milwaukee Bucks are a defense-first, -second, and -third outfit, and a pretty good one at that. Another one might be that we're cherry-picking players' most statistically productive seasons, which makes them look better and younger players look worse. Another possibility is that no team could deal with the sheer volume of injuries that the 2010-11 Bucks dealt with and remain cohesive on the court.
These are all valid points, and I sympathize with all of them. However, the truth of the matter is that offense and defense are two sides of the same coin in basketball. You can excel at one, but you still have to be somewhat competent on the other. With near-perfect defense, you could allow your opponent to score just one basket in 48 minutes...but it still comes up as a loss if the scoreboard reads 2-0 when the final horn sounds.
So where to we go from here? With a lockout looming, free agency will likely be delayed. Not like it matters, the Bucks' current cap situation renders free agency inconsequential for the near future. Either way, the draft is the key to the Bucks' long path to redemption.
With a record deserving of the 10th overall pick (pre-lottery), it's difficult to predict what the Bucks might do with it. Staying the course is one option, but there are several others. Trade up for a stud player? Trade down for better value? Trade out of this year's draft entirely, if it's as "weak" as everyone says it is? Impossible to say.
But, we can safely predict that part three of our series will look at the draft's recent history, to see if our numbers can tell us anything about the best way to get ourselves out of this mess.
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I wouldnt trade out of this draft...
Draft any type of scoring wing player, and for the first time ever give him time to grow and develop. We drafted Joe Alexander as a project and then traded him after one season. We let go of Jodie Meeks and now he’s scoring at high rates for high % in Philly.
And I also feel we need to hope one player drastically improves. If Jennnings becomes an All-Star then he will have a decent enough supporting cast if the team can stay healthy.
"I was looking at my résumé, feeling real fresh today, they rewrite history, I don't believe in yesterday."
-Kanye West
I agree with the Draft prognosis
Keep the pick you should be able to either get a wing who can score or a decent PF who may fit it later of help facilitate trades. Not sure there’s much else you can do other than hope that a few guys improve somewhat or Jeniings/Bogut really steps it up on the offense.
"You play anybody and if they shoot 70 per cent from three, they're going to be tough to beat." More wise words from Chris Bosh
yeah I agree we need some young talent on the wing
nail a good draft pick and suddenly things look a lot better, though this draft doesnt seem to be inspiring any great descriptions
That," says LeBron, "is for everyone that watches me play. They witness something special. You're all a witness.
Again I'll say it
Last year was supposed to be very deep and think of how many players really made an impact. You never know who you’ll get and what will happen with that player.
"You play anybody and if they shoot 70 per cent from three, they're going to be tough to beat." More wise words from Chris Bosh
yup
still imagine its the best way for the Bucks to build, sick of mediocre draft picks
That," says LeBron, "is for everyone that watches me play. They witness something special. You're all a witness.
sorry meant mediocre free agents
That," says LeBron, "is for everyone that watches me play. They witness something special. You're all a witness.
I'm also sick of mediocre draft picks.
Yi and Alexander. BLECH.
Editor at BT Powerhouse, a Big Ten Basketball blog.
Author at Acme Packing Company, a Green Bay Packers blog
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on May 8, 2011 6:20 PM CDT up reply actions
Alexander was a project, and everybody knew it
But Hammond thought that he was less important than getting the team on a run in the 2009-10 playoffs, which is why he threw him in the Salmons trade.
He might still turn out to be a good player, but Hammond traded his potential for Salmons’ scoring. If it wasn’t for Bogut’s elbow, last year’s team might have made a run at the 3rd round.
"Finished putting together an Excel spreadsheet at work? BELT. Finally managed to open that uncooperative jar of mayonnaise? BELT. We're all champions in our own ways, my friends." - Frank Madden, BrewHoop
by Mitchell Maurer on May 8, 2011 7:23 PM CDT up reply actions
And Hammond seemed ready to acknowledge Joe wasn't very good at basketball, which takes some real stones as far as I'm concerned.
Nevertheless, you deserve a…
BELT.
A noble spirit embiggens the smallest man.
by Steve von Horn on May 8, 2011 8:50 PM CDT up reply actions
yeah fair play it was smart move turning Warrik & Joe into Salmons.......
not so smart signing Salmons back up for 4 years
That," says LeBron, "is for everyone that watches me play. They witness something special. You're all a witness.
Easily one of the worst moves in recent history
I’d put it up there with Gadzuric’s contract and not letting Charlie Bell go.
"Finished putting together an Excel spreadsheet at work? BELT. Finally managed to open that uncooperative jar of mayonnaise? BELT. We're all champions in our own ways, my friends." - Frank Madden, BrewHoop
by Mitchell Maurer on May 9, 2011 6:26 PM CDT up reply actions
All of them not as bad
As the Allen trade though
"You play anybody and if they shoot 70 per cent from three, they're going to be tough to beat." More wise words from Chris Bosh
Please never mention the Allen trade again.
For the sake of my sanity…please.
A noble spirit embiggens the smallest man.
by Steve von Horn on May 9, 2011 9:08 PM CDT up reply actions
Deal
we need you sane.
"You play anybody and if they shoot 70 per cent from three, they're going to be tough to beat." More wise words from Chris Bosh
If you guys recall Part One, PER doesn't do a great job of measuring defense...
So who do you guys think should be adjusted upward and who do you think should be adjusted downward based on our defensive scouting eyes?
We would be interested to know what you guys think, and maybe later tonight or early tomorrow I can post some if the 82games data here in the comments as a statistical reference.
A noble spirit embiggens the smallest man.
by Steve von Horn on May 8, 2011 9:23 AM CDT via mobile reply actions
I'm not sure any should
Most of our players score around 13 which is rotation players and that’s exactly what they are IMO.
"You play anybody and if they shoot 70 per cent from three, they're going to be tough to beat." More wise words from Chris Bosh
kinda scary Earl Boykins kicks most of the Bucks players in PER
rockin
That," says LeBron, "is for everyone that watches me play. They witness something special. You're all a witness.
Think that shows that it's offensively biased
"You play anybody and if they shoot 70 per cent from three, they're going to be tough to beat." More wise words from Chris Bosh
fair enough...still its hardly complimentary
That," says LeBron, "is for everyone that watches me play. They witness something special. You're all a witness.
Can't agree more
But I think there is hope for this season, we can’t possibly be as bad as the year past.
"You play anybody and if they shoot 70 per cent from three, they're going to be tough to beat." More wise words from Chris Bosh
Offensively biased
But the problem is, you need offense.
The Artist Formerly known as Speedingtime/Speedy
by Jacob Grinyer on May 8, 2011 1:54 PM CDT up reply actions
Indeed we do
"You play anybody and if they shoot 70 per cent from three, they're going to be tough to beat." More wise words from Chris Bosh

The Artist Formerly known as Speedingtime/Speedy
by Jacob Grinyer on May 8, 2011 2:15 PM CDT up reply actions
im afraid to ask what that is
That," says LeBron, "is for everyone that watches me play. They witness something special. You're all a witness.
It's an OH RLY owl!
Google it.
The Artist Formerly known as Speedingtime/Speedy
by Jacob Grinyer on May 8, 2011 3:15 PM CDT up reply actions
I knew the owl
ORLY wouldn’t have guessed.
"You play anybody and if they shoot 70 per cent from three, they're going to be tough to beat." More wise words from Chris Bosh
maybe this doesnt translate well ;)
That," says LeBron, "is for everyone that watches me play. They witness something special. You're all a witness.
first time I ever heard it.....I feel left behind
That," says LeBron, "is for everyone that watches me play. They witness something special. You're all a witness.
ORLY?




"Finished putting together an Excel spreadsheet at work? BELT. Finally managed to open that uncooperative jar of mayonnaise? BELT. We're all champions in our own ways, my friends." - Frank Madden, BrewHoop
by Mitchell Maurer on May 8, 2011 4:07 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
Rec'd and +3000
The Artist Formerly known as Speedingtime/Speedy
by Jacob Grinyer on May 8, 2011 4:10 PM CDT up reply actions
haha first time i have even heard of this
That," says LeBron, "is for everyone that watches me play. They witness something special. You're all a witness.
Boykins on top of Carlos???
Ok. Right. This will keep me away from this kind of statistics analysis for another season. If the opportunity comes, I’ll continue to write about emotions and subjective perceptions. It will be more accurate.
I embrace advanced stats, but I also always try to strike a balance between the aesthetics, emotions, and numbers of the game… the trouble is people can get caught up in one but not any of the other aspects. I generally like PER as far as all-encompassing stats go, but I don’t think anyone would argue Boykins is better overall than Delfino… or that Maggette is better than Bogut.
But based on playing time and overall production,
Boykins might have an edge on Delfino. A part of this is the inherent bias towards offensive production, but Boykins has been a decent bench scorer in his career. Carlos hasn’t been a consistent offensive weapon.
http://twitter.com/WhalesLarry ...but only if you want to see someone still trying to figure Twitter out.
by Mitchell Maurer on May 10, 2011 6:15 AM CDT up reply actions
Check that,
Boykins might be more efficient. Straight up, Delfino is better. But Boykins has done more in the minutes he’s gotten than Carlos has.
http://twitter.com/WhalesLarry ...but only if you want to see someone still trying to figure Twitter out.
by Mitchell Maurer on May 10, 2011 6:16 AM CDT up reply actions
I wonder if Boykins is a player that can get more minutes than those he gets
For me, he’s the kind of player that’s ok when he comes from the bench to shatter a bit close defenses. If he plays big minutes, forget about team playing: he’s inable to assist, to make some decent pick and rolls, to cordinate an offensive in general. In fact, I believe Carlos can play the point better than him.
Maybe this analysis shows that Boykins has individually an edge over Delfino, but I’m sure the other player stats are better when Carlos is on court that when Boykins is.
One last thing: if this continues I might consider changing my nick to “Cabezaforthewin” :)
It's really an interesting issue to consider.
One of the reasons PER and other advanced metrics are expressed on a per minute basis is because most analysts reject the concept of diminishing returns (meaning they don’t believe that player performance deteriorates when given more opportunities).
HOWEVER, guys like Boykins seem to me to be a perfect example of why diminishing returns should still be factored in when comparing role-players to starters. No doubt Carlos faced much better competition on a nightly basis by virtue of going up against starters, and that probably had an effect on his PER values…meanwhile, Boykins came in for short spurts, with a clearly defined role, and with fresh legs, often going against backups or counterpart starters who had already logged big minutes in the game. If Boykins were to be promoted on the basis of his PER, I think we all know his numbers would fall hard. In contrast, if Delfino were demoted to a more specific bench role, his numbers would probably rise….and all of this is without taking into account defensive comparisons or positional flexibility between Delfino and Boykins.
As we said in the opening article, these advanced stats should be used as the starting point for discussion, not the ultimate arbiter of player value. Analyzing the context in which the opportunities arise for players is certainly something we as fans are better equipped to do than any of these box-score based stats.
A noble spirit embiggens the smallest man.
by Steve von Horn on May 10, 2011 11:37 PM CDT up reply actions
I think diminishing returns is absolutely part of it
Just like per/36 you can’t expect a guy who plays 5 minutes a game is going to be able to produce the same when a starter.
"You play anybody and if they shoot 70 per cent from three, they're going to be tough to beat." More wise words from Chris Bosh
Here's an interesting article about that:
http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=9206
The Artist Formerly known as Speedingtime/Speedy
by Jacob Grinyer on May 11, 2011 9:47 PM CDT up reply actions

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